Theakston's Old Peculiar

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Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:31 pm

Has anyone successfully brewed a Theakstons Old Peculiar. I had a couple of these on a hand-pump yesterday and it was a delicious, dark, smooth, silky, malty well balanced pint, it's a rareity to see it served in a pub in the South of England, even more rare on a beer engine, I used to drink alot of it in my youth when I lived in the North.

I have a recipe from GW's book, but I'm wondering what yeast it might use and what the mash schedule might be, I'm guessing a step mash with more time spent @ 71 C might get that silky malt sweetness?

Image
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby ChilliMayne » Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:02 pm

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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:19 pm

ChilliMayne wrote:im sure you googled and found this:

https://byo.com/recipes-tag/item/1510-theakstons-old-peculier-clone


I have now, thanks.

This recipe concerns me, the malt bill is far bigger than Graham Wheelers recipe, far more complex than an Old English Ale should be (I believe), the roasted malt troubles me (there is no roast flavour in this beer), the NB & Willamette hops are not traditional English hops, I'm not sure what the treacle would do if added to the boil, other than add fermentable sugar (probably more appropriate for priming to impart some flavour) and it's an extract recipe not AG! In fact it's almost a Porter recipe!

Mash temp of 70 C and the Scottish ale yeast could be a good choice though!

:beer:
Last edited by BrauTim on Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby ChilliMayne » Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:43 pm

you should email the brewery and ask what the hell....
Some of them are quite accommodating
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:02 pm

ChilliMayne wrote:you should email the brewery and ask what the hell....
Some of them are quite accommodating


Yeah, I'm not so sure that BYO has a handle on English styles :D
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby cpa4ny » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:34 am

Another BYO link.

Per BYO: "this beer should be somewhat similar to Old Peculier — smooth and very drinkable for its strength."

http://byo.com/stories/item/1201-old-ales
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:42 pm

I'm just sampling a bottled version of OP for a comparison with the cask version. There are differences, the bottled version has more bitterness, more roastiness, higher carbonation and more pronounced hop flavour, while it still has a malty backdrop it's lost the creamy, silky, deep malt & toffee flavours that the cask version has, still agreat pint from the bottle though. My preference is for the cask version as I'm a bluff old traditionalist Englishman and lean more towards malty beers than hoppy beers anyway.

I've noticed similar differences between bottle and cask version of English style beers that I've managed to do a comparison with, Ringwood Old Thumper is another beer that springs to mind. I think the reason is because bottled beers are made for a global market and international customers expect more hop and bitterness, especially in the US.

Here's one recipe that I've found may do it, I'll tweak it and post up what I do when I get around to brewing it, I've left the yeast out for the moment, mash schedule will be something like 15 mins @ 63 C and 75 mins @ 71 C followed by mashout, aiming for 1.058:

Code: Select all
pale malt/maris otter
10% crystal malt - 30 mins mash
5 % wheat malt
2.5% chocolate malt - 30 mins mash
1% black malt - 30 mins mash

10% black treacle - added halfway through boil

bittering challenger - 90min boil
flavour fuggles - 20min boil
Aroma E.K.Goldings - 10min boil


:drink:
Last edited by BrauTim on Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby piet_v » Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:55 am

10 % black treacle

Assuming you mean

Image

Don't, 10 % is way to much, for any style of beer. (it gives a lot of caramel taste in the finished brew).
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:36 am

piet_v wrote:10 % black treacle

Assuming you mean

http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/treacle.jpg

Don't, 10 % is way to much, for any style of beer. (it gives a lot of caramel taste in the finished brew).


Have you tried OP from the cask? It's not the same as the bottled version and has a much more caramely/toffee taste to it, what would you suggest?
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RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby piet_v » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:06 am

Here is a grain bill I used in a brew a couple of years ago.
The beer was well liked, and people singled out the caramel taste.
Perhaps you could do 1 % but I would not take it further.

Code: Select all
   %     Amount     Name                          Origin        Extract   EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 49.9     3.20 kg.  Pilsener 3                    België         46.72      3
 18.7     1.20 kg.  Munich Mout 15                België         17.52     15
  7.8     0.50 kg.  Vlokken ( Mais )              Nederland       7.94      1
  4.7     0.30 kg.  Cara Munich  ( 120 )          België          3.89    120
 14.0     0.90 kg.  Golden Syrup                  England        18.20     25
  0.6     0.04 kg.  Black Treacle                 England         0.65   1500
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Re: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby Cervantes » Sat Mar 29, 2014 1:25 am

Did you get any further with this?

I'm a Pom living in Australia and I really miss a decent real ale. I was from the New Forest and used to really enjoy a few pints of Ringwood Old Thumper or 49er.

Now that I have the BM one of my goals is to replicate some of the great British real ales that I miss so much.

Would be very keen to hear if you brewed this and how it turned out.

I have Graham Wheeler's book and although the recipes are great he doesn't give mash schedules. I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on mash schedules for real ales. Most things that I have read so far point to a single step with temperature dictated by desired body and a mash out.

Cheers
Andy
Cheers :cheers:
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Re: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby BrauTim » Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:04 am

Cervantes wrote:Did you get any further with this?

I'm a Pom living in Australia and I really miss a decent real ale. I was from the New Forest and used to really enjoy a few pints of Ringwood Old Thumper or 49er.

Now that I have the BM one of my goals is to replicate some of the great British real ales that I miss so much.

Would be very keen to hear if you brewed this and how it turned out.

I have Graham Wheeler's book and although the recipes are great he doesn't give mash schedules. I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on mash schedules for real ales. Most things that I have read so far point to a single step with temperature dictated by desired body and a mash out.

Cheers
Andy


Nice one Andy - Ringwood is 30 mins from me a great tour of the brewery can be had there, I brewed an Old Thumper clone just before Xmas with the Wyeast Ringwood strain, sadly all drunk now, it was a cracking brew and I'll be doing it again, I'll get the recipe posted when I get the chance.

Old Peculiar is next on my brew schedule, I might put it back a brew cos I'd like to get a Saison ready for the Summer, but I want an OP ready for Autumn, so I can't leave it too long. I'll post back here and in the brewday log when it's underway.

My thoughts about mash schedules are that they are mostly based on historical brewing techniques and equipment availability, with the BM I believe you can manipulate the strength of the wort to your own spec, I quite like the 63/71 step mash and these two temps can be manipulated with time to produce the wort you are trying to aim for. All said though, there is nothing wrong with a single temp, millions of brewers use that because of equipment limitations, I don't know what the differences would be because brewing on a homebrew scale means every brew is different in some way, despite aiming for repeatability.
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Re: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby Cervantes » Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:38 pm

BrauTim wrote:Ringwood is 30 mins from me a great tour of the brewery can be had there, I brewed an Old Thumper clone just before Xmas with the Wyeast Ringwood strain, sadly all drunk now, it was a cracking brew and I'll be doing it again, I'll get the recipe posted when I get the chance.


Where are you based? I'm originally from Lymington. I'm hoping to get back next year to visit my parents, so will definitely try and schedule a visit to Ringwood Brewery if I do get back.

And please do post the recipe if you have a chance. That would be a real blast from the past for me. We used to go the brewery and get a boxed keg every Xmas.

BrauTim wrote:My thoughts about mash schedules are that they are mostly based on historical brewing techniques and equipment availability, with the BM I believe you can manipulate the strength of the wort to your own spec, I quite like the 63/71 step mash and these two temps can be manipulated with time to produce the wort you are trying to aim for. All said though, there is nothing wrong with a single temp, millions of brewers use that because of equipment limitations, I don't know what the differences would be because brewing on a homebrew scale means every brew is different in some way, despite aiming for repeatability.


I have step mash schedules based on 63/71, but with a 38 mash in held for ten minutes. I have three schedules, Light (63 for 45 minutes and 71 for 15); Medium 63 for 30 minutes and 71 for 30; and Heavy 63 for 15 minutes and 71 for 45, but I'm not sure these will be spot on as I believe that the alpha amylase which are active at the higher temperatures are more active than the beta amylase which are active at the lower temperatures. If this is the case I my timings may spending too long at 71 and not enough at 63. I suppose time will tell as I get more brews under my belt and experiment a bit.

Cheers
Andy
Cheers :cheers:
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Re: RE: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby Dicko » Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:20 pm

piet_v wrote:Here is a grain bill I used in a brew a couple of years ago.
The beer was well liked, and people singled out the caramel taste.
Perhaps you could do 1 % but I would not take it further.

Code: Select all
   %     Amount     Name                          Origin        Extract   EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 49.9     3.20 kg.  Pilsener 3                    België         46.72      3
 18.7     1.20 kg.  Munich Mout 15                België         17.52     15
  7.8     0.50 kg.  Vlokken ( Mais )              Nederland       7.94      1
  4.7     0.30 kg.  Cara Munich  ( 120 )          België          3.89    120
 14.0     0.90 kg.  Golden Syrup                  England        18.20     25
  0.6     0.04 kg.  Black Treacle                 England         0.65   1500


Can I please ask;
What malt is "Vlokken"??
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Re: Theakston's Old Peculiar

Unread postby piet_v » Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:19 pm

Sorry, a bit of dutch in there, it's flakes, corn flakes.
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