A Brett finished saison

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A Brett finished saison

Unread postby Nesto » Sat May 24, 2014 5:29 am

I'm planning to try out a clone of Goose Island's Sofie next weekend. Here's the recipe I've put together from some internet research on a few different people who have tried to clone it. Fermentation will be primary with WLP565 Belgian Saison Ale yeast until I get to 1.016, then secondary with WY5112 Brett Brux. Also adjuncts of bitter orange and oak added 30 days in.

Code: Select all
BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Gracie: A Curly Tail Farmhouse Ale
Brewer: Ernie, Pete, Keith
Asst Brewer:
Style: Saison
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (30.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 27.60 l
Post Boil Volume: 21.90 l
Batch Size (fermenter): 20.31 l   
Bottling Volume: 19.31 l
Estimated OG: 1.065 SG
Estimated Color: 4.2 SRM
Estimated IBU: 19.5 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 78.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 80.9 %
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt                   Name                                     Type          #        %/IBU         
4.40 kg               Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM)            Grain         1        80.0 %       
1.10 kg               White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM)               Grain         2        20.0 %       
10.00 g               Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min   Hop           3        10.2 IBUs     
25.00 g               Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min   Hop           4        9.3 IBUs     
1.00 Items            Servomyces (Boil 10.0 mins)              Other         5        -             
1.00 Items            Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 5.0 mins)         Fining        6        -             
1.0 pkg               Belgian Saison I Ale (White Labs #WLP565 Yeast         7        -             
1.0 pkg               Brettanomyces Bruxellensis (Wyeast Labs  Yeast         8        -             
28.00 g               Oak Chips (Secondary 30.0 days)          Flavor        9        -             
28.00 g               Orange Peel, Bitter (Secondary 30.0 days Spice         10       -             


Mash Schedule: 00_BM20, Light Body
Total Grain Weight: 5.51 kg
----------------------------
Name                      Description                             Step Temperat Step Time     
Acid Rest                 Add 29.11 l of water and heat to 45.0 C 45.0 C        30 min       
Protein Rest              Add 0.00 l of water and heat to 56.0 C  56.0 C        15 min       
Saccharification - beta   Add 0.01 l of water and heat to 62.0 C  62.0 C        30 min       
Saccharification - aplha  Add 0.00 l of water and heat to 67.0 C  67.0 C        15 min       
Mash Out                  Add 0.00 l of water and heat to 78.0 C  78.0 C        5 min         
Sparge                    Add 2.50 l of water at 78.0 C           78.0 C        15 min       

Sparge: If steeping, remove grains, and prepare to boil wort
Notes:
------
Goose Island Sofie Clone

Created with BeerSmith 2 - http://www.beersmith.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby fy0d0r » Mon May 26, 2014 6:34 am

Are you planning to cold crash/filter/whirpool the primary yeast before adding Bretts ?
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby dinnerstick » Mon May 26, 2014 7:39 am

never had the original but i like the sound of the recipe! very simple. i have done a few with mixed saison yeast and brett as primary fermenters (and many with only brett, which makes a great saison-style beer) but never done one this way, let us know how it comes out. specifically, if i'm using brett as primary yeast then i add unmalted grains to fill out the body a bit, so i'm curious about your body. wow, what a creepy thing to say.
what sort of fermentation temperature regime will you employ?
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby Nesto » Mon May 26, 2014 8:33 pm

I have a temp controlled conical that I will use for the primary fermentation. I plan to start primary fermentation at 20C and let it ramp up to 25C over several days. I've had good results with that schedule on regular saisons. I will drop the trub while in the conical, then rack to secondary in a Speidel plastic fermenter (dedicated to sour beers) where I will pitch the Brett B. Not planning on cold crashing, but now that fy0d0r mentions it, maybe it would be a good idea to filter so I can remove most of the saison yeast and let the Brett work on the last few gravity points in relative peace.

Once in secondary, I plan to bring the fermenter into my house (20-25C ambient). My limited experience with Brett (just a few tries) has made me confident that Brett can handle almost any temp, so I won't worry about temp control and will just let it ride inside the house until I get down to about 1.010 before I add the bitter orange and oak. I expect this should get down to 1.008 before kegging/bottling.

I will say that I am a little concerned about my body as well ;) I want to make sure I don't overshoot 1.016 in primary. Not sure I should use the 62C rest and maybe raise the 67C rest to 68 or 69? Or maybe some unmalted wheat? Any thoughts?
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby fy0d0r » Tue May 27, 2014 8:49 am

I believe filtering (if you have the proper gear) is ideal in order to remove as much primary yeast as possible and allow Brett to finish their meal.

Otherwise I'd cold crush (if your conical can do it) to settle as much yeast as possible in the cone.

As for the body, don't think you can stop Bretts from eating everything up regardless of Mash temps (maybe it will take them a bit longer to eat more complex sugars from higher temps), but this shouldn't be an issue as formally Saison is one of the most dry styles.

P.S.
I've done a Saison on WLP565 recently with 10% unmalted wheat, I've started with 22C then raised gradually 1C/Day to 28C and then down to 3C.
It went from 13.5P to 1.8P in about 10 days, profile is "funky" enough even without Bretts (missing "pepper notes" as per some Beer Geeks, which were in place in a similar brew aged for 14 months though)
I've added some Brettanomyces Bruxellensis Trois in the bottles as I'm too lazy and limited in space to do proper barrel aging, so will taste the results in 6+ months (hope that bottles will not become glass grenades during aging :lol: )
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby Nesto » Tue May 27, 2014 9:49 am

fy0d0r wrote:I believe filtering (if you have the proper gear) is ideal in order to remove as much primary yeast as possible and allow Brett to finish their meal.

Otherwise I'd cold crush (if your conical can do it) to settle as much yeast as possible in the cone.

As for the body, don't think you can stop Bretts from eating everything up regardless of Mash temps (maybe it will take them a bit longer to eat more complex sugars from higher temps), but this shouldn't be an issue as formally Saison is one of the most dry styles.

P.S.
I've done a Saison on WLP565 recently with 10% unmalted wheat, I've started with 22C then raised gradually 1C/Day to 28C and then down to 3C.
It went from 13.5P to 1.8P in about 10 days, profile is "funky" enough even without Bretts (missing "pepper notes" as per some Beer Geeks, which were in place in a similar brew aged for 14 months though)
I've added some Brettanomyces Bruxellensis Trois in the bottles as I'm too lazy and limited in space to do proper barrel aging, so will taste the results in 6+ months (hope that bottles will not become glass grenades during aging :lol: )


Have a decent 1 micron filter, available so will probably do that. And I seem to remember WLP565 doesn't flocculate all that well, so I'm starting to think about cold crashing (doable with my conical), then drop trub and filter while transferring to secondary with Brett B.

Don't know what I was thinking about mash temps preventing the Brett from gobbling up nearly everything... D'oh! Had a horrible Doppelbock ferment a few years ago. Finished primary at 1.059!! Couldn't get any yeast to work further. After the lager yeast, we tried an ale, a wine and finally a champagne yeast. Nothing. Finally pitched some Brett L and BOOM! 2 months down to 1.019
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby fy0d0r » Tue May 27, 2014 10:21 am

Yep, they're even told to eat the sugars (cellobiose) from the oak barrels when there is nothing else left :shock:
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Re: A Brett finished saison

Unread postby Nesto » Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:57 am

An update on this. I ended up not filtering before secondary. Primary finished right at 1.016. Decided I wanted the WLP565 to be able to continue to clean up some greenness and, what might have been my imagination, a hint of diacetyl. Let Brett B work for a month down to 1.007 before adding the bitter orange and oak. The orange and oak stayed in a week. It is fantastic now. I think I have more orange than I really wanted, but it's ok. Plan to let it sit for a while now and see how it develops.
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