Double mashing

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Double mashing

Unread postby gert » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:23 pm

I never did double mashing, but I'm thinking of it. How does this actually work when you have a multiple step mash?
Just imagine:
- first mashing ends at 78° for several minutes.
- after rinsing, emptying and refilling the malt pipe, start the second mashing.
- but the first step in the mashing cycle is 52° (while the wort temp is still +/- 75°). And after rinsing there is enough water/wort in the kettle (so no need to add cold water).
Do you have to wait long enough? How does this work?

Thanks.
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby Okire » Sat Mar 22, 2014 6:55 am

Hi Gert

I would go for single step mash, say 65 deg. abort the program when first mash is done and restart with the next mash, with this one, do the mash out at 78.

/Erik
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby Lac » Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:51 am

When I had removed the mash I would lower my copper chiller into the wort and cool down on the way and then start with the next mashing.
Last edited by Lac on Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby tmzand » Sat Mar 22, 2014 12:19 pm

I double mashed an imp. stout recently. I programmed a long (double) rest and paused the BM in the middle of it to change to new malt in the pipe. I also sparged the first mash with 78 deg water 1l/kg malt before dumping the spent grains. I think i lost 1 or 2 degrees wort temp during the pause.

This was my first try at double mashing and I ended up with 1,090 OG after 90min boil.
The beer is being conditioned with oak chips (chipped whisky barrel) and not ready yet so I can not comment on the result.

Give it a try.

/Thomas
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby BrauTim » Sat Mar 22, 2014 4:18 pm

This forum is great - whilst reading this I had a flash of inspiration which links in with this thread about making higher gravity beers, with the 50BM it would be possible to mash with 50L malt pipe and then the 25L malt pipe straight after to get the higher gravity.

Using the wort chiller to lower the temp back down to 1st sacch rest is also a great idea.

:beer:
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby gert » Sat Mar 22, 2014 8:03 pm

Thanks for the posts!
In case you want to do a multiple-step mashing, you'll need to chill the first wort: good to know!
I can't think of another solution.
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby Twonky » Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:31 pm

BrauTim wrote:with the 50BM it would be possible to mash with 50L malt pipe and then the 25L malt pipe straight after to get the higher gravity.
:beer:


I think I posted this question also (but maybe on another forum...)
For me it also seemed like a good idea because it would save the time of cleaning out the malt pipe before you can continue with the second mash.

Why would you start with the 50l MP?
My initial thought was to start with the 25l MP.....

Cheers
:cheers:
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby gert » Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:59 pm

Twonky wrote:
Why would you start with the 50l MP?
My initial thought was to start with the 25l MP.....


:cheers:


That's the best for the 25/50-combination, indeed.
I was just doing research for a BM 200l. (maybe I'll buy one next year) After being in contact with Speidel, they suggested to do a double mash to get heavier beer. In my case: I use 6,2 kg malt for 20l, so for the 200l that must be 62 kg. But the malt pipe is only 42 kg. Therefore Speidel suggested double mash, but was only speaking about a single-step mash. And that's not the case for me.
Otherwise you can only get max. 150l strong beer out of a BM 200l. (with 2 hours of cooking).
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby Cervantes » Sun Mar 23, 2014 10:54 pm

BrauTim wrote:
would be possible to mash with 50L malt pipe and then the 25L malt pipe straight after to get the higher gravity.

:beer:


Do Speidel sell spare malt pipes?

Then you could work with two 50L malt pipes and BM 20L owners could buy a spare 20L malt pipe and double mash as well.

I have read elsewhere though that when double mashing the fact that the wort is already saturated from the first mash means that mash efficiencies for the second mash are pretty poor.

I know it's not a popular option amongst the serious "All Grain" aficionados, but an easier option to get your OG up would be just to add sugar or dry malt extract during the boil.

Cheers
Andy
Cheers :cheers:
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RE: Double mashing

Unread postby Nesto » Mon Mar 24, 2014 5:01 am

Cervantes wrote:
BrauTim wrote:
would be possible to mash with 50L malt pipe and then the 25L malt pipe straight after to get the higher gravity.

:beer:


Do Speidel sell spare malt pipes?

Then you could work with two 50L malt pipes and BM 20L owners could buy a spare 20L malt pipe and double mash as well.

I have read elsewhere though that when double mashing the fact that the wort is already saturated from the first mash means that mash efficiencies for the second mash are pretty poor.

I know it's not a popular option amongst the serious "All Grain" aficionados, but an easier option to get your OG up would be just to add sugar or dry malt extract during the boil.

Cheers
Andy


I'll 2nd the extract path for bigger beers. I've done 2 X 1.080 OG beers with LME. Have a good local and fresh extract supply. One was a Doppelbock the other a Doppelweizen. Both were excellent!
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Re: Double mashing

Unread postby cpa4ny » Tue Mar 25, 2014 1:56 am

For high-gravity beers, my approach is two-fold:

- For Belgian-style beers, I'd add sugar to boost the gravity.

- For other big beers (Dopperbocks / IIPAs), I'd double mash.

My view on this is that I didn't buy a USD 2k contraption to mix DME/LME into my beers.

But that's just me :drink:
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Re: Double mashing

Unread postby Twonky » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:37 am

cpa4ny wrote:For high-gravity beers, my approach is two-fold:
My view on this is that I didn't buy a USD 2k contraption to mix DME/LME into my beers.


5kg of LME is about 35 euro's....
25kg of malt is about 26 euro's...

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Re: Double mashing

Unread postby cpa4ny » Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:11 am

Twonky wrote:
5kg of LME is about 35 euro's....
25kg of malt is about 26 euro's...

:cheers:


Good point Twonky - better flavors from "real" malt and lower cost.

Checks all the boxes for me :wink: :beer:
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Re: Double mashing

Unread postby Twonky » Sat Apr 19, 2014 10:08 am

I was bottling my IPA yesterday and had an idea, see how good repetitive work without requirements for brain activity are for the creative process ;-)

What if....
I raise the malt pipe a few cm by placing three blocks under it in the BM (maybe some oak blocks, don't think that would impart anything bad to the brew :?: )
Then add 50l of water (BM50) set the mashing temp, add malt pipe when temp is right, bottom screen, 14kg of malt, and the top filter plate.
And then to circulate, draw off wort from the tap, and add to the top of the malt pipe.
If you have a pump life could be sweeter ;-)
Or if it is easy to re-route the original pumps....??

I circulated the wort this way once before when the rubber ring got displaced under the malt tube, and the pumps could not circulate. I aborted the program set the temp, and went to it with a beaker. That brew turned out fine, so in practice this has already been tested ;-)

Drawback is that during the mashing period you do not get any rest, but according to my calculations this should end you up with roughly 35l with an OG of 1097
And seems less work than a double mash...

I'm not in the opportunity to try this soon, but wanted to the share the idea anyway, if anyone does try please post the results. And so will I after I have done this with my next brew ;-)

Cheers
:cheers:
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Re: Double mashing

Unread postby Twonky » Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:22 pm

Kick.....

Maybe I'll get an opportunity to test this next Sunday....
I sure hope so, a) wondering if this will work, b) been to long since previous brew session ;-)

Cheers
:cheers:
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